Welcome to The B2B Mix Show. We’re focused on digital marketing and sales topics to help you elevate your B2B brand. Check back on Mondays for new episodes.

This week on The B2B Mix Show, we speak with Pete Gillett of Zuant about the impact of marketing automation and salesforce automation on CRM. If you deal with or depend on one or all of these systems, you don’t want to miss this episode.

During our conversation, Pete touches on the following issues:

  • How tech stack purchase decisions shouldn’t be made in a vacuum or siloed by department
  • Whether or not companies are best-served by vendors that create integrated suites of all three platforms
  • The benefits that come with integrated platforms from the standpoint of productivity and efficiency gains
  • The importance of systems integration and data harmonization when it comes to compliance with privacy legislation
  • And more

Want to connect with Pete online?

Email: pete@zuant.com

Twitter: @gillettPeter

Twitter: @ZuantApp

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/Peter-gillett-673a0a5/

About The B2B Mix Show:

The B2B Mix Show with Alanna Jackson and Stacy Jackson is brought to you by Jackson Marketing. Need help with your B2B online presence? Let’s talk!

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Episode 31 Transcript

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Stacy
Jackson:

Hi,
everyone. I'm Stacy Jackson.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

I'm
Alanna Jackson. We are the co-founders of Jackson Marketing and in case you
still haven't heard, we are also sisters. We're bringing you Episode 30 of
the B2B Mix Show. Stacy, what's the topic of today's episode?

 

Stacy
Jackson:

Today
we're talking about something that's really important for companies to pay
attention to. However, Alanna and I have both seen that not everybody does.
It's about the impact of marketing automation and sales force automation on
CRM. This isn't just a conversation about technology and how systems affect
one another. It's really bigger than that. If these three pieces of your tech
stack aren't working together, you've got data issues, sales and marketing
efficiency and productivity issues. You might even be hampering or even
jeopardizing customer experience and leaving your company open to privacy law
infringement and spam noncompliance. So this is a really important topic.
We've brought in an expert to discuss it with us.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

His
name is Pete Gillett and he is the CEO of Zuant.
Alanna, why don't you introduce Pete to our listeners?

 

Alanna
Jackson:

Absolutely.
And an expert he is, which are going to find out why. Pete Gillett is CEO of Zuant, where he's responsible for driving product
development and client rollouts of the company's award winning mobile lead
capture app across US corporations. He is also CEO of Market Point Recall, a
global recall and crisis management company, a pioneer in database marketing
since the late 1970s. Pete is a serial entrepreneur. He created the world's
first web-based CRM system funded by Lucent Technologies in the 1990s.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

In
2010 Pete, launched the first CRM applications for the iPad and CRM lead
generation and follow-up are still in the focus of Zuant
and its network, Nascent Call Centers around the globe. In 2017, he was voted
one of the 40 most inspiring people in sales lead management by his peers.
With four decades of experience in marketing and sales, Pete is highly sought
after thought leader on hot button topics like mobile and GDPR.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

He
writes a regular monthly column series for MarTech
series where he explores what's new in marketing and sales from a global perspective.
Today's Zuant and Market Point are Pete's sole
focus, but he is excited as ever about innovation as more and more new
technologies enable highly visual and cost-effective versions of the original
databased marketing concept to be offered to world leading global companies.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

Pete,
welcome to the B2B Mix Show. We're excited to have you.

 

Pete
Gillett:

Oh
yes, thank you. What an introduction. Yeah.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

Anything
else you'd like to share with us, Pete, about your background or the
companies you work with?

 

Pete
Gillett:

I
don't think so. I think you've covered the whole thing, I think at the time,
I will happily.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

All
right, we'll wrap it up. That was a great podcast guys.

 

Pete
Gillett:

Great.
There we go.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

So
Pete, before we start talking about the impact of marketing automation and
sales force automation on CRM, maybe we should start with a few general
definitions just to ensure all the listeners are on the same page as us. So could
you just tell us your definition for all three of these pieces of the tech
stack?

 

Pete
Gillett:

Yeah,
I think the core ingredients, obviously the CRM side, customer relationship
management. I come from a database marketing background and that term seems
sort of faded away in the 90s early 90s and replaced by CRM, customer
relationship management, which doesn't really do a good enough job, does it?
Because that's really to include also it should be PRM, prospect,
relationship management, and suspects, and so on. So it's all of those
contacts with the outside world. Salesforce automation then is not a robot
sales force yet even though AI is going to have a go at doing that in the
future. But it's about providing productivity tools to really focus the
attention of sales guys on the right prospects and customers, and help them
along the way. Whereas marketing automation is of course managing content and
distributing information to the right people within your CRM database.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

We
know that in an ideal world, all of these systems should work together,
right? So there are always examples where companies are siloed in their
departments and different decision-makers are making purchase decisions.
They're getting a sales tool or they're getting a marketing technology. All
their tech stack is done separately without consideration for all the
different areas and finding out they're going to play nicely. So how should
companies approach this type of decision-making?

 

Pete
Gillett:

Well,
I mean this is really the big subject. It has been the big subject for the
last two decades because you go back to the late 90s and the market was
dominated by this new emerging Siebel Company that
had its larger market share that Salesforce.com does now. Their mission
really was to have everything all on the one mini computer
based system. So taking over from the old IBM days. But since then, so many
other systems have emerge, they're so good within their own niche, within
that so siloed area that companies have wanted to use those new systems in
that area. We've lost that integration. Then I was chatting to friend of
mine, Jim Dickey the other day from Sales Mastery, and he had this good
comment about this. It's quite timely. We've talked about that yesterday.

 

Pete
Gillett:

You
wouldn't buy a new Tesla model three and and expect
it to be delivered on the drive with the separate drive train and interior
fittings and panels and so on and expect you to go ahead and use the product
unless you're a real DIY expert. It is really incredible that we go to CRN
conferences even today and the big subject is integration. The larger the
company, harder it is to integrate these systems, the more and more people
want their own applications dealt with well. They don't care about the rest
of the company. They want to obviously do a good job themselves. So
integration is the biggie. It's not really worth having a CRM system or any
of the other systems unless you get this integration done. So much money
spent when the bigger goal is never achieved.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

Do
you think some of that it comes down from the top down because maybe they're
not communicating how they need to be working together? Do you think that
that's part of the problem? Because a lot of these companies aren't thinking
about, "Oh, this might impact sales or this might impact customer
support," or something like that. Is that part of the issue from the top
down that that communication is not happening?

 

Pete
Gillett:

Yes,
for sure. It's really that second level in a big borg,
isn't it? It's marketing management. It's sales management and event
management. I'd obviously bring them into this picture now as well. Those
guys have their own jobs to do. Take the sales management side, the sales
team, they've always been fairly maverick, haven't they? About just doing
their own thing. As long as they get the sales in, that's the power. The
money's rolling in, then no one's going to tell them what to do.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

Right.

 

Pete
Gillett:

That
that's the problem is it's getting all three around the table and putting in
an integrated plan together. All three of those will not necessarily have the
right knowledge and experience on tech products. They'd probably come up
through the roots just doing it the old way, doing a good job and bringing IT
into the picture isn't easy either. So you really need some form of special
agent who's going to be a really good communicator, a really good motivator,
have a pretty good technical knowledge. That's like finding gold, isn't it?
To find those people that are going to be those ultimate capitalists.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

I
wonder, what do you think, I know that there's always been friction between
sales and marketing and misalignment. But do you think all these new
technologies as they've emerged have caused more issues because companies
aren't making sure the tech stack is integrated?

 

Pete
Gillett:

Yes,
I think so. It's not just those three tech products we talked about. I mean,
another important one that really I think is just as important to all three
would be your telephony system. The new cloud-based telephony systems to
linked to your outside call center network or to have your internal inside
sales team on that system. That's a really important ingredient that keeps
your CRM data up to date, nurtures leads to go into your sales automation
package. and also follows up the leads that you've generated at your events
and trade shows and so on.

 

Pete
Gillett:

So
I think that's the fourth dimension in this, the tech stack that really is
just as important as the other three and it should be considered. But once
again, that makes it even more complicated because that's someone else to
bring into the picture. Your call center managers probably got no experience
of events and perhaps I'm not a marketing automation either. So it really is
a challenge and I'm not saying it's easy to do.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

Do
you think organizations that try to make it easier on them themselves would
be best served by going to a vendor who has most of the components integrated
together or is it possible to not have to lean on a HubSpot or a Salesforce
and to assemble different pieces of technology to work together effectively?

 

Pete
Gillett:

I
think the way the market is at the moment, it's better to still have the best
technology for each application. They're likely to come from a different
vendor. I don't think one has emerged that really gives you that one
integrated package. When you look at Oracle who have acquired particularly in
the last three of four years, a number of top line products, Eloqua Marketing
Automation, bolts this on the business to consumer side. Then they've got
various content management, social media platforms all in their sales and
marketing suite. But they're still silos really. Some of those products can
be too heavy for some companies who want the modern light cloud based systems
that are available together, like a HubSpot, like our Zuant
system for events and so on. Fast and light is really what you need I think.
Easy to use. Yeah, those sort of features.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

It's
got to be hard to be the best in all of those different areas because they're
different. They're so different. Like you said, if you want the best, you
most likely have to go to separate solutions and then make them all work
together. I think that that's one thing that people kind of lose sight of is
I want the easiest way to make this happen. But they're maybe not making the
best decisions for their company, right?

 

Pete
Gillett:

Yes,
absolutely. I think the application should always come first because that's
going to make that area. If it's your core, your inside sales team, they need
the best software to be productive and efficient. Integration now isn't as
hard as it it used to be. There are some easy ways
of connecting through APIs so all of the data can flow back. I think the CRM
should always be at the center as the sort of one version of the truth when
it comes to all of your data audience and have all of these other applications
pulling that data and synchronizing both ways with the CRM at the center.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

Right.
Many people listening to the episode most likely have some solutions in
place. Maybe their solutions work together and maybe they're siloed, I don't
know. But what are some reasons that listeners should audit their tech stack
to ensure that better data harmonization is happening? What benefits are they
going to get out of that? What are they going to experience from that? Like
upsells, cross-sells?

 

Pete
Gillett:

So
good integration is really going to give them, I'm taking in an Oracle
phrase, speed to lead. Everything is faster these days, isn't it? If we go as
a prospect onto a company's website and you expect to be able to chat someone
in in realtime or complete a form and have a
response within an hour.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

Right.

 

Pete
Gillett:

Having
good integration means that that visit to a website can flow quickly through
to the CRM, start providing information to you over whatever channels you
want almost instantly, and trigger a phone call or a visit if you're a
business to business inquiry. So that speed is an important part of the
integration.

 

Pete
Gillett:

The
other aspect of it is that you can make sure that your well, sales
productivity is so much quicker because you're going to be faster than your
competitors to follow up those leads. You're going to be able to make sure
that whether it's your inside sales team or your sales force themselves,
they're going to be talking to the people at the right time and not
irritating them when they're not in the market. So there are those two
competitive advantages. thirdly, the big one and the big payback on all of
this is that if someone isn't in the market from that initial inquiry or when
they went to your trade show booth, they may have all the right credentials
to purchase from you and you're a good lead. But you're not going to have
budget approved maybe for 12 months down the road.

 

Pete
Gillett:

Most
systems that aren't integrated won't have any way of following up those
people. If the initial leads or people come to your trade show booth, maybe
only three or 4% of them are ready to buy now. There's that lurking 20% that
are just sitting there, they're fully qualified, but you need some integrated
system to make sure that they're followed up and nurtured over well maybe
longer, 12 months, 34 months. We even had a lead the other day that we first
spoke to seven years ago and they've just purchased our product literally
last month, so-

 

Stacy
Jackson:

Oh
wow.

 

Pete
Gillett:

They're
still out there somewhere.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

I
imagine too that when all these systems work together that it helps the
people if you're in an account management situation where you can have better
customer experiences and loyalty and keep people engaged between signing the
contract each year.

 

Pete
Gillett:

Yes.
Yep. No, for sure. So much can be done now content without the old
traditional face to face meetings. It's in so many industries. It's rare to
actually meet people, isn't it? So it's so much easier these days to have a
web meeting, ping someone in an email prior to their contract being about to
expire, have a review. You don't get to know people over the web. That's why
you see the rise of of systems like Zoom for
instance, that make this so much easier with their Zoom Rooms for web
meetings and collaborating between different offices and so on.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

Definitely.
So beyond the benefits of integrating these systems, I think a lot of people
would be well-served to prevent some risk by making sure they're integrated
because we've got laws about spam, there's GDPR in the EU. What other
considerations are there? How can these systems working together protect a
company?

 

Pete
Gillett:

Well,
yes, GDPR. That's a really important one, but I missed out earlier on because
I always think the GDPR is a good thing. A lot of our clients take that on
board as their global privacy policy. We've got the Californian legislation
coming in from January the first that mimics pretty closely the EU's GDPR and
unless you've got that central CRM data connected to your other systems, and
that includes mobile as well, of course. People forget that salespeople,
they've used mobile phones.

 

Pete
Gillett:

That's
almost their main touchpoint for CRM data. But that's the wild west. There's
no thought to have any sort of opt-ins normally of those guys on the road day
to day. So integration is once again vital to have all of those touch points
linked back so you have really easy opt-in, permission to hold someone's
data.

 

Pete
Gillett:

And
just taking it further, so it's a really positive thing from a marketing
point of view to run a preference center to say, "Okay, what information
do you want to receive? And about which products? How frequently? What
channels? Do you want to get a text or suppress your email?" It's a
better experience for customers. So I always think GDPR is a really positive
thing. Yeah. Getting that in place is virtually impossible for the larger
companies in reality or less, where it's that person that's in charge of
getting everyone integrated and, and educating people on the benefits of
GDPR. I think one of the things you need to have if you're a company over a
certain size is a data protection officer. I always think that sounds like
the Gestapo or something.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

Right.

 

Pete
Gillett:

You're
going to steer clear on that guy if you cross paths on the stairs in the
office. Why not change that name to something much more positive? Give it a
little bit of a marketing spin. The positive integration manager, I think
that's better.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

Right.
There you go. So are there any best practices or tips that you can offer just
in general to kind of help our listeners if they're thinking about maybe they
need to make their systems all work together, what are some best practices
that they should follow to make it happen?

 

Pete
Gillett:

Wow.
So I think it's more human engineering. So we laugh about a data protection
officer, but a larger company needs to find someone who's going to take that
role. So finding someone, I think possibly from marketing is going to be the
best place. So looks after that data side and takes on that role of forcing
through the integration. In a way, has to become the friend of each of the
different departments that you're looking to integrate with.

 

Pete
Gillett:

You're
inside sales team, the sales manager and whoever's in charge of sales force
automation, look at how they're using their systems and then to make their
life easier, show them what the benefits will be by integration, by having
more up to date data, maybe a bigger pool of quality data to work from, more
leads, more leads that are in the right buying cycle stage. The end of the
day, what's going to make things more productive and more profitable is going
to be the big thing that that makes that person a superstar in the
organization and then truly recognized by the C level guys.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

Right.
And everybody wants to be recognized. Right, and given that recognition and
be the superstar.

 

Pete
Gillett:

I
think so if they're getting the results, why not?

 

Alanna
Jackson:

Right.

 

Pete
Gillett:

Let's
spread the word, marketing can work.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

Right.
Right, potentially. Pete, we have one last question for you. It's a just for
fun question.

 

Pete
Gillett:

Oh
wow.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

If
you weren't leading Zuant and Market Point Recall,
what would your dream job career be?

 

Pete
Gillett:

Well,
I do enjoy the product development side, that's for sure. So something in
tech. I have a keen interest in motor sports, so something in a sort of high
tech area of sort of Formula 1 world. The other area would be something in
the eco space.

 

Pete
Gillett:

So
there's some really cool new inventions that need backing, and funding, and
promoting to help reduce plastic usage around the world and in the oceans,
which everyone's concerned about at the moment, and getting rid of plastic
packaging and having stuff that's biodegradable to wrap your sandwiches in
for lunch and so on. So something in that role would be great. So I could use
my tech and my marketing skills to help a start up in that area would be fun
to do.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

Yeah.
I'm not surprised that that would be something that you would like to do. I
mean, development seems like it's in your blood.

 

Pete
Gillett:

Yes.
Yes, exactly. I drive the techies mad everyday with new ideas and stuff. They
said, look, let's just focus this, just keep doing what we're doing at the
moment. That's the real battleground.

 

Stacy
Jackson:

Right.
Well, Pete, thank you so much for joining us and sharing your insights on the
impact of marketing automation and sales force automation on CRM. If our
listeners would like to reach out to you or have any questions for you or
want to connect online, what's best way for them to get in touch?

 

Pete
Gillett:

My
email address is probably the easiest. So Pete@zuant.com, so it's
Z-U-A-N-T.com is the easiest. So delighted to hear from anyone.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

All
right, so there you have it. If you weren't already aware, it's time to
ensure your sales roles, marketing and service platforms are all working
together to help meet corporate goals, staying in compliance with various
laws and deliver better customer experiences. So take a hard look at your
tech stack and see what you may need to make improvements on.

 

Alanna
Jackson:

If
you want to get in touch with me or Stacy, you can hit us up on social, on
Twitter. You can find Stacey at Stacy_Jax. That's
S-T-A-C-Y underscore J-A-X. And you can find me at Allana_Jax.
That's A-L-A-N-NA underscore J-A-X. And if you're not a Twitter fan, you can
look us up on LinkedIn. Don't forget, you can always leave us a voicemail on
the Anchor mobile app or on our show page. Have a great week, everyone.